Newbie Questions: The Magick Circle and Triangle -- how does it work?

[Chade]

I suspect your original message didn't propergate properly, which is
why you've only had a reply from a single loon. Don't worry though, I
expect some more loons will be along presently.

Meanwhile I've added some comments.

I've been reading a variety of documents and can't seem to get a straight
answer about the functions and reasons for (1) the magick circle, and (2)
the Triangle.
So far there seem to be two clear ideas: (1) the circle focuses energy
(like a lens) and the triangle cages the evoked spirit. Or (2) The circle is a
sphere of protection and there is no triangle.
Any opinions?

The circle divides the universe into the inside and the outside. Leave
your worries outside and they won't distract you.

If I evoke without a triangle, where does the spirit appear?

In whatever your staring at until your eyes go silly. Be it smoke,
mirror or whatever.

Can one evoke (or invoke -- sorry if the terminology is wrong) to the Astral
Plane without a Triangle?

Yes.

If so, where are the mirror or crystal ball
placed?

In the WMT outside the circle, usually at a convient height. Others
vary, in Vodoo for instance, as I understand it, the evoked spirit
'rides' the subject.

If one evokes to the triangle, what happens if the creature is too large to
fit in?

To take the commonly used magick mirror you stare at it in bad light
and chant until your own reflection distorts. Like the game 'Bloody
Mary'.

Teleportation: Can one enter the Astral Plane at point A, travel to Point B,
then enter the Material Plane at Point B?

No.

Can one travel from Magick Circle to Majick circle?

What?

If one commands a spirit on the astral plane, how can the command be
carried out on the material plane?

By your own actions, as the spirits live inside your head. This is
more subtle and profound than it sounds.

Sorry if these seem like stupid newbie questions, but the mechanics
seem a little confusing and contradictory.
Please post replies to this newsgroup. Any help appreciated.
TIA
--Bex.

An old time reg who has done a lot of work on this has a website at:

http://www.templeofastarte.com/

if you check the alt.magick archives he posted as 'gnome de plume'

http://tinyurl.com/35cx2j

alt.magick.moderated is a MODERATED newsgroup.
Consult http://www.alt-magick-moderated.org/ where you
may locate the newest Posting Guidelines and Charter
for the newsgroup before your first post. Contact the
Moderation Team at ***@alt-magick-moderated.org

[Erwin Hessle]

Post by Chade
I suspect your original message didn't propergate properly, which is
why you've only had a reply from a single loon. Don't worry though, I
expect some more loons will be along presently.

You need to fix your newsreader, son, they're "propergating" (as
opposed to what? "impropergating"?) just fine for everyone else.

Erwin Hessle, 8=3

alt.magick.moderated is a MODERATED newsgroup.
Consult http://www.alt-magick-moderated.org/ where you
may locate the newest Posting Guidelines and Charter
for the newsgroup before your first post. Contact the
Moderation Team at ***@alt-magick-moderated.org

[Chade]

Post by Erwin Hessle

Post by Chade
I suspect your original message didn't propergate properly, which is
why you've only had a reply from a single loon. Don't worry though, I
expect some more loons will be along presently.

You need to fix your newsreader, son, they're "propergating" (as
opposed to what? "impropergating"?) just fine for everyone else.
Erwin Hessle, 8=3

Thanks Erwin, it's nice to know your care.

When I sent the message Bex's only other reply, from Fr. O., had been
a warning to master the Middle Pillar ritual before attempting any
evocation.

Even though the message your replying to is dated the 29th it was
actually sent *before* the message dated the 28th that starts "Still
no sign of my first comments, so I'll comment again." What *you've*
quoted above are in fact the comments I was referring to in *my*
previous quote.

Basically, the Yronwoods can't run a moderated newsgroup for toffee.

[Erwin Hessle]

Post by Chade
Basically, the Yronwoods can't run a moderated newsgroup for toffee.

Now why doesn't that surprise me?

Erwin Hessle, 8=3

[Patrick Schaaf]

Post by Erwin Hessle

Post by Chade
Basically, the Yronwoods can't run a moderated newsgroup for toffee.

Now why doesn't that surprise me?

Oh please. It has always been up to the moderators to decide, on an
ongoing basis, how much policy enforcement they think is neccessary.
Given the extreme low-volume nature of amm, a lax enforcement is
fully understandable. There's always cancelling after unwanted
content, and I'm sure that if volume and miscontent warrants it,
they'd have their robomod software rejecting crossposts and
using cryptographic approval in no time at all.

best regards
Patrick

[Chade]

Post by Patrick Schaaf

Post by Erwin Hessle

Post by Chade
Basically, the Yronwoods can't run a moderated newsgroup for toffee.

Now why doesn't that surprise me?

Oh please. It has always been up to the moderators to decide, on an
ongoing basis, how much policy enforcement they think is neccessary.
Given the extreme low-volume nature of amm, a lax enforcement is
fully understandable.

While your apologising for them maybe you could explain why they would
reject Bex's original message but approve my reply?

Post by Patrick Schaaf
There's always cancelling after unwanted
content, and I'm sure that if volume and miscontent warrants it,
they'd have their robomod software rejecting crossposts and
using cryptographic approval in no time at all.

According to their website *any* crosspost is explicitly banned.

"II. B. The fundamental guidance for this newsgroup's moderation
policy is provided by its charter, which states that "Any submission
not specifically restricted by the Moderation Policy will be accepted
for posting." The following are violations of the Moderation Policy:
...
II. B. 6. Crossposted posts, to any number of groups, to any
hierammy."

BTW what do you make of rule II. B. 1. banning "Posts that ADVOCATE
anything, whether pro or anti."?

http://www.alt-magick-moderated.org/posting-guidelines.html

[Patrick Schaaf]

maybe you could explain why they would reject Bex's original message but
approve my reply?

No, I can't.

Post by Patrick Schaaf
There's always cancelling after unwanted
content, and I'm sure that if volume and miscontent warrants it,
they'd have their robomod software rejecting crossposts and
using cryptographic approval in no time at all.

According to their website *any* crosspost is explicitly banned.

No. The website says, as you quoted, that submissions not specifically
restricted by the moderation policy will be accepted. That does not
say anything, or make any guarantees about, what will be rejected.

BTW what do you make of rule II. B. 1. banning "Posts that ADVOCATE
anything, whether pro or anti."?

Thou shalt not proselytize. Good rule.

best regards
Patrick

[Erwin Hessle]

Post by Patrick Schaaf

Post by Chade
BTW what do you make of rule II. B. 1. banning "Posts that ADVOCATE
anything, whether pro or anti."?

Thou shalt not proselytize. Good rule.

And one that you've just broken.

Erwin Hessle, 8=3

[Patrick Schaaf]

Post by Erwin Hessle

Post by Patrick Schaaf

Post by Chade
BTW what do you make of rule II. B. 1. banning "Posts that ADVOCATE
anything, whether pro or anti."?

Thou shalt not proselytize. Good rule.

And one that you've just broken.

Yes. But only a tiny little bit. And that rule is broken so often anyway
that I doubted that it would complain. Wrong, as usual. Sigh.

[Chade]

Post by Patrick Schaaf
No. The website says, as you quoted, that submissions not specifically
restricted by the moderation policy will be accepted. That does not
say anything, or make any guarantees about, what will be rejected.

"The following are violations of the Moderation Policy:...Crossposted
posts, to any number of groups, to any hierammy."

[Asiya]

Post by Chade

Post by Patrick Schaaf

Post by Erwin Hessle

Post by Chade
Basically, the Yronwoods can't run a moderated newsgroup for toffee.

Now why doesn't that surprise me?

Oh please. It has always been up to the moderators to decide, on an
ongoing basis, how much policy enforcement they think is neccessary.
Given the extreme low-volume nature of amm, a lax enforcement is
fully understandable.

While your apologising for them maybe you could explain why they would
reject Bex's original message but approve my reply?

Post by Patrick Schaaf
There's always cancelling after unwanted
content, and I'm sure that if volume and miscontent warrants it,
they'd have their robomod software rejecting crossposts and
using cryptographic approval in no time at all.

According to their website *any* crosspost is explicitly banned.
"II. B. The fundamental guidance for this newsgroup's moderation
policy is provided by its charter, which states that "Any submission
not specifically restricted by the Moderation Policy will be accepted
...
II. B. 6. Crossposted posts, to any number of groups, to any
hierammy."
BTW what do you make of rule II. B. 1. banning "Posts that ADVOCATE
anything, whether pro or anti."?
http://www.alt-magick-moderated.org/posting-guidelines.html

The newsgroup charter listed on the same site contradicts the posting
guidelines.

"Cross-posted messages (messages that are posted to more than one
newsgroup at the same time) will be accepted on alt.magick.moderated.
However, a message that is cross-posted should be on-topic for ALL
groups that it is being posted too. In addition, any messages that are
'heavily cross-posted' will be weeded out by the robomoderator and
will not appear on any newsgroup that they are posted to. A message is
'heavily cross-posted' if it is posted to five or more groups at the
same time. Directly-related newsgroups are not counted toward this
five-group cross-post limit."

Who knows? I used to check on a.m.m. from time to time, but gave up after
the content was always only Nagasiva's cross-posts.

[Chade]

Post by Asiya

Post by Chade
According to their website *any* crosspost is explicitly banned.
"II. B. The fundamental guidance for this newsgroup's moderation
policy is provided by its charter, which states that "Any submission
not specifically restricted by the Moderation Policy will be accepted
...
II. B. 6. Crossposted posts, to any number of groups, to any
hierammy."

The newsgroup charter listed on the same site contradicts the posting
guidelines.

It also insists on an odd number of mods, yet as far as I'm aware
there are two mods; the Yronwoods.

Post by Asiya
"Cross-posted messages (messages that are posted to more than one
newsgroup at the same time) will be accepted on alt.magick.moderated.
However, a message that is cross-posted should be on-topic for ALL
groups that it is being posted too. In addition, any messages that are
'heavily cross-posted' will be weeded out by the robomoderator and
will not appear on any newsgroup that they are posted to. A message is
'heavily cross-posted' if it is posted to five or more groups at the
same time. Directly-related newsgroups are not counted toward this
five-group cross-post limit."

Thanks, but it doesn't help. Bex's original post, and my reply, were
both posted to five groups. Yet one was approved and one wasn't.

Post by Asiya
Who knows? I used to check on a.m.m. from time to time, but gave up after
the content was always only Nagasiva's cross-posts.

What they do in a.m.m doesn't worry me. Posts shouldn't be stopped
from appearing in a.m though, even if rejected for a.m.m. If
everything looks fine locally, which it could, newbies would be non
the wiser.

[Kisai]

Post by Erwin Hessle

Post by Chade
Basically, the Yronwoods can't run a moderated newsgroup for toffee.

Now why doesn't that surprise me?

tyagi and Cat are both occult packrats. They aren't practioners as
much as collectors. It does not suprise me that now that they've
"collected" alt.magick.moderated, they don't really know what to do
with it besides let it moulder on a shelf.

[Erwin Hessle]

Post by Kisai

Post by Erwin Hessle

Post by Chade
Basically, the Yronwoods can't run a moderated newsgroup for toffee.

Now why doesn't that surprise me?

tyagi and Cat are both occult packrats. They aren't practioners as
much as collectors. It does not suprise me that now that they've
"collected" alt.magick.moderated, they don't really know what to do
with it besides let it moulder on a shelf.

To be fair, that's actually the best thing to do with it, although I'm
sure the silly little crone and her kept whipping-boy have no real
conception of this. Almost all moderated fora on this subject very
quickly turn into nothing but a venue for deluded fuckheads to
continually congratulate each other on the mutual validity of their
fatuous and callow opinions. I suspect that is indeed the reason that
the Ironheads have collected it, since everytime they take their bogus
folksy voodoo shit into any kind of unmoderated forum, everybody
laughs at it like the utter horseshit that it is, which apart from
hurting their egos also hurts their sales.

Erwin Hessle, 8=3